Quit Going to Church!
Now, I cannot remember where I found this but it has the ring of some stupid church person forwarding schlock around the internet:
A Churchgoer wrote a letter to the editor of a newspaper and complained that it made no sense to go to church every Sunday. "I've gone for 30 years
now," he wrote, "and in that time I have heard something like 3,000 sermons.
But for the life of me, I can't remember a single one of them. So, I think I'm wasting my time and the pastors are wasting theirs by giving sermons at all."
This started a real controversy in the "Letters to the Editor" column, much to the delight of the editor. It went on for weeks until someone wrote this clincher:
"I've been married for 30 years now. In that time my wife has cooked
Some 32,000 meals. But, for the life of me, I cannot recall the entire menu for a single one of those meals. But I do know this .. They all nourished me and gave me the strength I needed to do my work. If my wife had not given me these meals, I would be physically dead today. Likewise, if I had not gone to church for nourishment, I would be spiritually dead today!"
Obviously, this guys wife is a bad cook and he is incapable of making a sandwich. He must be the guy that all of the Hardy's commercials are aimed at. I would contend that it makes no sense to go to church for slightly different reasons including the following:
WARNING: sweeping generalizations ahead...
CAVEAT: I know, I know, your church is sooo different, your pastor would never act like this, and the "real" church that you go to is full of love, kindness, and goodwill just like Jesus. I'm sure it is.)
- Most of the crap spewed out during the sermon is so absent of truth that you should either (a) go to church and not listen to/forget what you've heard or (b) just not go.
- All of the fake people who try to blow sunshine up your butt when things are bad when all you need is some real compassion, understanding, and friendship.
- All of the power-hungry, manipulating bastards who want your money, time, energy, or children.
- Isolationistspeople who want to separate themselves from "the world" and ignore the hurting around them when they, ostensibly, have the cure to the hurting.
- To show the church leaders that you want something different can buy crap at Wal-Mart, hear lies on TV, be manipulated at work or school, be robbed of my dignity by my "friends", and be ignored because I'm of no consequence just about anywhere. I WANT JESUS AT CHURCH NOT THE CRAP YOU ARE SELLING!
Tell me the reasons you don't go to church.
Tell me the reasons I should go to church. I want to know because right now, I see no reason to go.
posted by Scott at 8:34 AM
18 Comments:
it is hard to go to a place that you "are"
I, you and all are the church. So how do I go to "me"?
Peace
Geo
I watch football on Sunday's sometimes to watch my fantasy players.
Church can be boring and devoid of any real interaction
Doesn't help the people in the community enough, so why go?
Church I attend has some good messages but the rest of it doesn't do much for me (sing dance and all that)
Basically, if the church got more invloved in real issues in society I would fell more inclined to belong, as it is, they are 'too into themselves'.
Geo, I think you know that I'm refering to the activity. Unfortunatly, those who are the church don't see it in the biblical way, that's why we end up with this dog and pony show that is commonly known as "the church."
I remember a few years back when I had helped a friend with some landscape work at his house. We had to do some digging, and moving dirt around, so I got pretty dirty. I left to head back home around 11:30, and about half way home, my car broke down. It turned out to be only a broken fanbelt, but at the time I wasn't sure what was wrong.
As I popped the hood and stared into the engine compartment, I noticed that there was suddenly a lot of traffic zooming by the tiny country road I had stopped on. I looked up and noticed that the cars were exiting from a large church (I later found out that they had about 600 attendees), so I thought this was a good place to break down, because surely someone from this church would stop to help me. Well, as you might guess, no one did.
I was finally able to get in touch with my friend (he was in the shower when I called earlier), and he came to help me. After the car was fixed, and had a nice long talk about people and compassion. It was not a discussion the church people would have liked.
It may be helpful to make a distinction between the Church (big-C: Christ's body) and the church (small-c: the conventional "institution", or the activity).
Can you tell us what you really think? :)
Great blog you have. Thanks for sharing it.
Hi Scott.
Love your blog.
Looks like your on a journey like the rest of us. Don't sweat it. Especially don't sweat the small stuff.
I choose not to go to church because I see it only as business. The "churches" we see are built from resentments. I say this because each one group thinks it will be better than the other. When I was in the group lol.. we were best. Now you can have the same attitude when your outside of the church that your IT.
So in my heart I never feel to tell someone to leave a church or whatever because if your growing in God and loving his people... amen.
I believe in the UR (as it is labeled)... because it breaks down all the walls. Everyone of them. There is freedom and not an US and THEM attitude anymore.
In Him
Lori
Your "sweeping generalizations" are caustic implications of the modern day church.
In my opinion, they are also naive, contrived and typical blog-dribble.
C'mon... can't we come up with any complaints more relevant than these? God! Yeah, church has its faults. I'm the first to agree. But the regurgitation of the same ol' crap about church is why I quit blogging myself.
Nothing personal. I agree with what you're saying. I really do. But if all bloggers do is sit around bitching about church's lack of originality and meaning, all-the-while, lacking originality and meaning ourselves, what the hell is the point?
At least church has donuts...
Did somebody say "donuts"? Now you got my interest.
hehehe...
Everybody, thanks for the input and responses. As you may have noticed I get a little fired up. Unfortunately that leads me to sound a little like I've got the answers, I clearly don't. I appreciate your company on my journey.
Jeff, so what you are saying is that you've gone through this process and you've expeienced the anger and grief associated with being lied to for a long time and you've complained and even in some cases whined to people about this experince. That's all well and good but you're now telling me that I can't do it. Not only is that insensetive but it's hypocritical.
I'm trying to get beyond 15 years of lies. Like others, I have given thousands of dollars to a cause that I now feel is unworthy of that kind of support. I now realize that those people who I thought were my friends were just trying to manipulate me (for the most part). Please excuse me if I whine a little, if I'm unoriginal, and if I repeat something you've done.
Now that I've let that go...what should we do? I want to get past this and I am, in a way, but I'm not sure how to include other people in my journey without sounding like a heratic or coming across as a new age freak.
Right now, I'm working this out in three ways.
Interact with God: I go for long walks on Sunday morning to think, pray, and be thankful.
Learn: I am reading several book that share a similar experience.
Interact with Others: I am blogging when I have time. Sometimes I feel really encouraged by the conversation that goes on in the blogs that I visit but at other times I feel like I'm being manipulated just like at church.
So, thanks pastor Jeff, you've made me think.
Manipulation, dangerous ground.
Jeff, so what you are saying is that you've gone through this process and you've expeienced the anger and grief associated with being lied to for a long time and you've complained and even in some cases whined to people about this experince. That's all well and good but you're now telling me that I can't do it. Not only is that insensetive but it's hypocritical.
Wow. You got all that from my comment? Well, just so you'll know, that's not quite right. I've gone through this process and realized that I was the one with the problem.
I came to realize that it wasn't that I was lied to or unjustly manipulated. It was the fact that I put all my focus on the church as the source of my spirituality. I'm imperfect, and I cannot expect those in the church to be anything but imperfect as well.
For me, I must forgive them, love them, and try my best not to be like them... either in church or on my blog.
I'm glad you're working things out, Scott.
I would encourage you to keep searching and expressing yourself. My original comments weren't telling you not to. I just get a little suspicious when the "nroad generalizations" are word-for-word, from one blog to the next...
I just get a little suspicious when the "nroad generalizations" are word-for-word, from one blog to the next...
Do you think it's a conspiracy?
Maybe it's just a lot of people experiencing the same feelings, and stating those thoughts in a similar manner? Just a guess...
Do you think it's a conspiracy?
No. I think it's a lot of people on the same road, leading each other to the same conclusions, sometimes at the expense of independent thought... kinda like church.
That was the point of my original response. Not that Scott is wrong in his feelings/observances. But that the blogs are looking a lot like church in reverse, these days.
We're guilty of polarizing anyone who disagrees with us, just like the church. We're guilty of seeing the wrong in every dissenting view, without the possibility of any real sense of inward criticism, just like the church. We're guilty of regurgitating the same information, trying to find new ways to make it sound fresh, just like the church.
Remember, I stated rather clearly that I agree with Scott's observances. And since I didn't know where he is in his journey, I probably shouldn't have even said anything (my apologies, Scott).
I've just come to the point where I'm tired of the easy pot-shots at the church, because I am the church and I attend a church. Yeah, my church has issues just like everyone else's. It just confuses me that we feel such need to show Christ's love to everyone, giving the benefit of the doubt to gays, jews, blacks, democrats... just pick a group. Yet the best we can do for churchgoers is to lump them into trite, overused, broad generalizations, automatically assuming the worst in some very well-meaning folks.
Jeff, I think that in many ways you are correct. In theory, I appreciate you calling me out on the generalizations. What I mean is that I too value independent thought. However, right now I'm quite happy that I have found a group of people that agree with the independent thoughts that I've harbored for a long time. For the first time, I can make known my fears and concerns without being judged and chastised. So, when someone does come and "disagree", I feel like I can dole out a little of the same that I've received in the past because I am no longer in a position of weakness. Is this the right thing to do, no! Does it make me feel better, you betcha. But, it is wielding power and that is wrong.
In a way, I feel like Bill Gates. I was once one of the downtrodden, nerdy, outcasts because of my beliefs. Now, in the company of other nerds and we've discovered something wonderful and valuable that the others don't see. That gives me and the other nerds power (I wish it were money).
So, the question becomes, how are we going to handle the power we have? Will we beat others down with it? No, that would be wrong. The object and the real test is: can we be benevolent?
Tied up in this question of benevolence, is the uncertainty of how to proceed. Right now, for me, the how to proceed question is bigger than the benevolence question.
So, what does this all mean? Well, it means that I am still making mistakes. I need some direction and God is giving it one turn at a time (I think I’d prefer a map with zoom capabilities). I appreciate input from others like you Jeff and Bruce. Between the three of us, we are all at different points in the journey and it is evidenced by our responses to the blogdom. I get angry and hurt, Jeff is tired of the pot shots at the church, Bruce is supportive and a peacemaker. I think the things we need to do are support each other, call bullshit by name, and try to figure out where this goes next.
Jeff, keep me honest, I really do appreciate it. I don’t want to turn into another form of church that accuses and misuses power. But, consider that I haven’t struggled with this as long as you have.
Fair enough.
Sorry I allowed my frustrations with the entire anti-church blog-world to heat up my response to you.
I guess I would just ask you to remember that God loves those people you feel have deceived you. And He commands us to love them to. Of course, their trust has to be earned.
Back to your original post:
Tell me the reasons I should go to church. I want to know because right now, I see no reason to go.
There are a lot of well-meaning folks in church who do not even realize how spiritually lame/crippled/ineffective they have become. If they have no contact with true life, they'll never realize they're dead.
So work out your issues, then go back and show them life, one person at a time. We cannot fix the institution, but we can rescue the insitiutionalized.
Photini, Thanks for the encouraging words. Honestly, I often need that. It's been a tough couple of months for me and to be frank, I'm not sure where it's leading.
I am glad to hear about your conversion and growth, it is promising. I hope the best for the adoption process. I know for mere mortals like us it can be a difficult process to endure. If you only had the money and fame of Madonna...
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